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You are listening to another Voice of Freedom radio program, your source of alternative

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information, always uncensored, often politically incorrect and sometimes revisionist in nature.

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This is Ernst Zündel broadcasting another Voice of Freedom program from WRNO radio on 15.420 megahertz

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on the 19 meter band every Sunday at this time. We have another very interesting show for you today.

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I'm Ernst Zündel from the Voice of Freedom program and I'm speaking with David Irving,

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the famous British historian, in London, England.

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Yeah, I say London, England, because otherwise people may think I'm in London, Ontario, and

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then you'll get all sorts of people in Ottawa, ministers getting hot under the collar and

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there'd be police cars dashing here and there again, I suppose.

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Now, Mr. Irving, can you give us a kind of an update what you have been up to? The Canadian

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media reported you won a very important victory in Australia.

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Indeed, yes. In the middle of September, we finally had the result of our appeal against

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the Australian government ban on my entry in that country earlier this year. You remember

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I was supposed to be doing a one-month tour of Australia in March and guess who put pressure

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on the Australian government to refuse me a visa this time? I've been there two or three

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times before. I mean, there's no need to name names except the name of Paul Keating, the

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Prime Minister of Australia, who is in the pocket of these people, it turned out. The remarkable

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thing there, comparing North and South, is that the Australian press did a very fine

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investigative job, came down 100% on my side. Every single Australian newspaper published

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an editorial on my behalf, saying it was a scandal what Paul Keating, the Prime Minister,

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had done to me. And then they investigated why he'd done it, and it turned out that he'd

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been taking money, his party, the Labour Party, had been taking massive money from these

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organisations, these lobbies in Canada. And we fought it in the federal court in Australia,

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we lost the first round. I, very heart and mouth, had to go ahead and authorise my lawyers

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to have a second attack, appealing it. And in the appeal, the three judges, none of whom

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had the name Rothstein, like our famous judge in Toronto, the three judges with names like

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O'Kelly and Banyan, all unanimously ruled that I should be allowed into Australia and

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that the Minister had broken the law in refusing me the visa. We're still waiting for the visa,

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though. That ruling was handed down on September the 16th. The Minister has told the Australian

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Jewish News that he's going to take his time in reaching a decision, so he's dragging his

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feet. So, only a few minutes ago, in fact, I've spoken with my solicitor in Australia.

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He phoned me here in England, it's three o'clock in the morning at present time in England now,

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he phoned me to ask for fresh instructions, and I said, go for it. I said, let's go for a court

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order against the Minister, ordering him to give me the visa. He had to pay $100,000 costs

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on the last action. That's the Australian taxpayer and voter, and let's see if he's prepared

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to stand yet more costs. I couldn't have done it, I have to say, without worldwide support

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from about a thousand people now who are helping me to fight these major legal battles.

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Isn't it amazing that a writer and a researcher and a historian of your note, with 34 books

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to his name, has to resort to having, to build up virtually a kind of a financial bodyguard

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around the world that you can publish your works. Incredible.

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Well, Ernst, you and I, we're both learning the same thing. We're up against very, very rich

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people with very powerful vested interests. The heads of the Australian Jewish organizations,

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the two brothers, called Mark and Isidore Leibler. It's strange that their name is Leibler.

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That reminds us of the famous Anti-Defamation League, I suppose. The Leibler is there.

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And the brothers, Leibler, are, in fact, multimillionaires. So people like you and me,

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with our very limited bank resources, are up against people to whom money is literally

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no object. They can hire people to smear. If they were minded to this kind of person,

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they could hire people to kill, I suppose, if they want to do. But at present, they're just

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assassinating characters. They pour buckets of slime over people like you and me, and

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the knowledge that if they pour enough slime, then some of it's going to stick. And this

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is one of the great tragedies, that I can take it. I've got a thick skin, an elephant skin.

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I emerge from the ooze, stinking and slimy, but I still carry on like a bull elephant charging

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through the forest. But there are innocent people out there. And I'm thinking of Fred Leuchter,

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who's been in jail for four weeks now. And my heart went out to him. Poor old Fred Leuchter,

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who's totally unpolitical, who's just an expert professional consultant doing his job and speaking

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the truth as he saw it. He finds himself locked away for four weeks in solitary confinement by

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the German government at the behest of these same people, of course, because they know that

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it's the end of the run, that it's the end of the game for the game's up. They're the

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ones that I really bleed for. Yeah. He had no idea when he got involved in

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going to Auschwitz to research these alleged gas chambers for me. He used to say that he

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couldn't believe what was happening to me in Canada, and that he was an American. It

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couldn't happen in America. It couldn't happen to him, because the Americans are protected

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by the First Amendment. But unfortunately, the First Amendment doesn't reach as far as

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Germany. Yeah, he found that out. You know, being an expert as I am on the history of

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Germany in the 20th century, writing about Goebbels in the Weimar Republic and about the

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Nazis in the Third Reich and then about the Germans. You know, nothing's changed. This

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is what strikes me about the German legal system. The lawyers, the judges, the police under the

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Weimar Republic, under the Third Reich, and then in the Federal Republic of Germany. Now,

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nothing has changed except, you know, they don't have to wear the armbands anymore. But they

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still click their heels, and they still fling up their arms in imaginary salutes, and they

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still carry out orders from whoever the minister of the day is. Nothing else has changed.

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Yeah. I was, as a German person, naturally, I always cringed when people said that and

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made these charges against my own people. And then...

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It didn't used to be like this. All this has happened in the last three or four years,

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hasn't it? Until three or four years ago, we could go about our lawful businesses in Germany,

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doing our... doing what... we're publishing our books, making speeches, meeting people.

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But now, suddenly, it's become like behind the Iron Curtain. An invisible Iron Curtain

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has come down now along the English Channel.

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Yeah. I must say that when I researched material for my trial, and I found out that Hitler, for

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instance, was banned from speaking in all German provinces, except for two, before he came

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to power. Banned from speaking. I thought to myself, can you imagine?

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There's a lot of parallels with the present day, and yet the Germans have just not learned. The more

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you ban a person, it's like those red ants that you stamp, you trample them into the concrete

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with your boots, and they pick themselves up and straighten out their legs, and they go marching

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off proudly again. Yeah. And the more you try banning somebody, the more people... I mean,

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let me give an example. The Germans, two weeks ago, I made... I was supposed to speak at the

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University of Munich on November the 9th, and I arrived. I was in... The previous month,

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I was in the United States. Thank God for the land of the free, I will say. I was speaking

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in the United States. These people got in touch with me and said, could I possibly speak in

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Munich on November the 9th? So I said, listen, we know what the police are up to. They're

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going to prevent me from speaking, as usual, so let's make a rendezvous. And we had one phone

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call from Alabama to Munich in which we agreed the rendezvous. We didn't even name the city.

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We just had a certain restaurant, which is a kind of a chain of restaurants right across

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Germany. And we said, I'd meet these people there at 4.30 that afternoon, and I'd fly

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straight in from the United States. And I wouldn't... And of course, I'd take certain precautions

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when I fly to Germany. So there was no way these people could know. And yet, 4.35, the state

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police, the state security police, pounced on the restaurant and handed me the papers and

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all the rest of it. Obviously, they'd wiretapped that one phone conversation. It is like a police

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state. And they ordered me to leave Germany. I've been going to Germany now for 35 years.

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I'm one of Germany's most famous historians. I'm the man who discovered the destruction of

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Dresden and wrote the book on that. I've done the German people so many favors. If people

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talk about Dresden now in the same breath as they talk about Hiroshima and Nagasaki, it's

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because of me, because of my book. Sure. And yet here I am, being hounded out of Germany

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like an outlaw, like a common criminal, because these people have paid the German government

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to take these steps against me. And yet these people are so stupid, because they're living

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in the dark ages. They're living in the age of the Old Testament, when video machines

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and tape recorders and satellite television didn't exist. I'm going to make a video speech

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now, an 80-minute video, a 90-minute video, which is going to be called in German, Ich komme

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wieder. I'm coming back. I may not be coming back in the flesh, but I'd be coming back by

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video, and I'd be carrying, I'd be speaking to the Germans just the same. And what do

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the German government think? That they can prevent people transmitting ideas across frontiers

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nowadays? With fax machines?

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With fax machines? Life isn't like that anymore. Life isn't like that anymore. And you can see

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the way the dictatorial mind thinks. When I researched my book on the Hungarian uprising of 1956, I

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went to Hungary, which was still at that time still a communist country. I went there many

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times, seven or eight times, behind the Iron Curtain to interview people. And to my astonishment,

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I found that in Hungary, the communist Hungary, before the uprising, and in fact until the

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war came down, if you had a typewriter, you weren't allowed to have a typewriter unless

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you registered a copy of the typing that that typewriter did with the local police. You weren't

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allowed to have a photocopying machine. That was totally banned. Only very select people

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had photocopying machines, because of course it could be used for propagating the spoken or

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the written word. Yet it's the same thing happening now again in democracy. Despite the Helsinki

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Accords and all these other paraphernalia of democracy that people put their ink to a few

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years ago, they're doing just the same as the Stalinist regimes of the 1930s.

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So are you saying then that because those regimes totally misread their own people's minds and the

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public's mind, that we're going to see an implosion, let's say, in Germany, in France?

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I don't think so. I think we're dealing with the Germans with a bovine race of people at

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present. They've been stupefied by 50 years of re-education. This is the horrifying thing.

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You go to Germany now. I'm not talking about East Germany so much or Central Germany as the West

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German people. The East Germans and the Central Germans are very open-minded, and you can speak

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very frankly to them and have delightful conversations. But the West Germans have been

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so browbeaten by their liberal left-wing media, which I think is now riddled with former Stasi

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members. This is the only information I've got, that the Stasi, the former East German security

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police have now managed to infiltrate. They've invaded the Western media and all the sleepers

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who were already there and have, for two years, have been wandering around like headless chickens

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because the Soviet Union has gone and the East Germans who were paying them has gone.

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Now at last they've found their voice again and they're beginning to organize again against

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us.

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But the West German people, I think, you're going to have to give up on this generation because

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they are totally brainless and stupefied, except for a very small minority who are capable

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of thinking for themselves.

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Now, are you seeing then that the Anglo-Saxon, the English-speaking world and the periphery

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of Germany, that the kind of the liberation, the mental or spiritual or even political liberation

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of Germany has to come from the outside in?

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I think so, yes. And I think that we're doing the right thing. You with your broadcast and with

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your samizdat and with your direct mail, this is one thing the German government hates because

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they cannot intercept direct mail. They can probably stop a small fraction of it, five

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or ten, or even if they stop twenty, even if they stop fifty percent of it. It reminds

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me of the flying bomb campaign against London during World War II, which I remember quite

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vividly. I was only about five or six at the time, but those are weapons you never, ever

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forgot. Now those were pilotless planes, the flying bombs. They had no pilot in them, but

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for a long time, RAF Bomber Command and RAF Fighter Command believed that they would

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obey the same rules of statistics as piloted planes, that if you shot down five or ten percent,

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then the Germans would call off the attack. But you could shoot down fifty percent of the

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pilotless planes, and they still got through. The bombing still went on because the Germans

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didn't care. They weren't losing any pilots. And it's the same with your direct mail shots.

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Even if the German government intercepts fifty percent of whatever you mail over to Germany,

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the other fifty percent is going to get through. And so they're resorting now to dirty tricks,

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and I don't have to tell you the dirty tricks, like seizing bank accounts, or putting people

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like Fred Leuchter in prison, or deporting people like me.

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Now, I had of course hoped, and you had already agreed, that you would show up as an expert

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witness, and now of course, you being banned from Germany, you cannot show up as an expert

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witness. This is another one of these... I would suggest that you apply for it.

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I see. And if... I would suggest that the lawyers,

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Hermann and the other lawyers, that they apply directly for me to appear, and

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certainly it's worth a try. I can certainly get in. All the worst they can do is throw me

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out again.

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Now, time is running on here. You are working on two books at present. One is called

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The Churchill II, or have you completed that?

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Churchill's War. Churchill's War, the famous biography, Volume 2, is now ready, and it's going

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to be out in March or April. It has to be, because I should be going down to Australia

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then, to carry on the tour, if I've then got the visa. And we're going to be promoting

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that volume, the second volume of Churchill, all over Australia and New Zealand, followed

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by the Americas.

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Now, is it again a large, large book, like the first one?

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It's the same size as the first volume, and it takes the story up to July 1943. It's got

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the whole of the inside story about Pearl Harbor. You know, the British government has just released

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a lot of documents, code-breaking documents. And it's old hat. It's stuff that we've known

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20 years ago or 10 years ago about the code-breaking. The British government is still keeping the

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really crucial documents on Pearl Harbor under its hat. But I think I've deduced what the

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secret there is.

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So what is...

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The other book I'm doing is next autumn is the biography of Dr. Joseph Goebbels, which

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is coming out in the United States in a regular publishing house. But I'm not going to mention

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the name of the publishing house, because otherwise, guess who will put pressure on that publishing

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house to violate the contract?

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Now, how about Churchill's War No. 2? Are you publishing that with your own Focal Point

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publishers, or...?

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Yeah, Focal Point is doing that around the world in conjunction with Veritas. You know,

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people... I get very indignant about this. In New Zealand, the big New Zealand magazine

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called North and South has just published a 15-page article on You and Me, in fact. You haven't

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seen it yet. It's their leading monthly magazine. And they say Mr. Irving's Churchill book, which

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described Churchill as being a drunken bum and a coward and all the rest of it, no mainline

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publisher would agree to print it. Now, that is not true. The Churchill biography has been

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printed and published around the world by mainline publishers in England by Hutchinson, in the

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United States by Avon, in Germany by Rowohlt, and so on. But that's how these legends develop.

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But, in fact, we do a better job. Focal Point does a better job. People who have seen my Focal

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Point edition of the Hitler book will agree that we do a better production job than the average

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publisher, because we use the publisher's share of the money to turn out a damn good deluxe

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product with colour photographs and the rest of it.

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Now, in that Hitler book that you're mentioning, that's an 800-page book, isn't it?

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Nearly 1,000 pages.

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Nearly 1,000 pages.

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It's got 250 pages of photographs, including 100 in full colour, which has never been published before.

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And the title of that is, again, for our listeners?

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Hitler's War. Hitler's War, Churchill's War, that I'm writing Roosevelt's War next year.

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This is coming up, again, from an in-line American publisher.

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Now it's time to make a little commercial here. The Hitler's War is then 1,000 pages, 250 pages,

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some of them are coloured photos, never before published.

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We sell it in Canada for, I think, $55, don't we, which includes the mail charges and the rest of it.

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Right. And do you have those in stock?

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I've got about $250 left, but we're going to reprint it. That's a book that's never going to go out of print.

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Now, how about Churchill's War No. 2? How much would that be selling for?

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Churchill's War is going to retail in England at about just under £20 a copy,

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so you can work out what the dollar rate is and add a bit on then for mail charges.

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And will you have photos in that book, too?

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A lot of photographs will be in that book, too, yes.

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And the same good quality, classic paper?

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There are very few good quality colour photographs of World War II on the British side, unfortunately.

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There are a lot on the German side, but not so many on the British side.

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Now, how about a Goebbels book? Will that be a large book?

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It's a big book. The original manuscript was nearly 2,000 pages,

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and I've trimmed it down to about half that length.

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Wonderful photographs.

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The most magnificent photographs.

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Nearly all of them unpublished.

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I've obtained photographs from his very early years,

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photographs from his youth when he was at university,

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right the way through to the end of his life.

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I don't see why I should publish the photographs.

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You know the photographs that were taken after he was dead.

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Every other author seems to think,

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hey, let's have a picture of the charred corpse lying there with a fist in the air.

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I don't go in for that kind of thing.

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I think it's indecent.

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I think it's obscene to publish photographs like that.

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So it's not going to be that kind of book.

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But I've got beautiful photographs of the family,

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original photographs of the family,

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taken by a Hamburg studio.

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And I've got the actual original photographs from the studio files.

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And a lot of color photographs, too,

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which we're publishing for the first time on Goebbels.

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Now, when people, you know, want,

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they listen to us on shortwave,

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they can hear us all around the world,

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could you give us your address where people could write to you,

18:07.740 --> 18:10.040
at least for a book list, and you can fill them in?

18:10.100 --> 18:10.900
I'll give you two addresses.

18:11.340 --> 18:11.600
Okay.

18:11.600 --> 18:14.460
If people want to take a piece of paper and write this down,

18:14.520 --> 18:14.960
two addresses.

18:15.120 --> 18:19.280
In London, it would be David Irving, 81 Duke Street,

18:19.520 --> 18:22.420
Duke Street, London W1.

18:23.960 --> 18:27.140
I'll repeat that, 81 Duke Street, London W1.

18:27.800 --> 18:29.220
And in the United States,

18:29.300 --> 18:30.900
they can reach me through a post office box,

18:31.260 --> 18:33.220
post office box 1707,

18:34.260 --> 18:36.460
1707 in Key West, Florida.

18:37.260 --> 18:39.580
That's the zip code 33040.

18:39.580 --> 18:43.180
So that's the post office box of the fighting fund,

18:43.260 --> 18:45.280
which we're funding all these worldwide legal actions

18:45.280 --> 18:46.500
against our traditional enemies.

18:46.860 --> 18:48.840
So anybody that wants to support you

18:48.840 --> 18:52.240
can write you in the United States or in England,

18:52.660 --> 18:54.880
and they can get a book list from you

18:54.880 --> 18:56.180
and also can contribute.

18:56.980 --> 18:58.060
People who donate to the fund,

18:58.160 --> 18:59.500
they get a handwritten letter from me,

18:59.820 --> 19:00.800
a personal acknowledgement,

19:00.800 --> 19:04.100
and we're very keen to have as many people as possible

19:04.100 --> 19:05.120
because for once,

19:05.200 --> 19:06.720
we're in a position now to fight back.

19:06.820 --> 19:08.280
We've got 1,000 people worldwide

19:08.280 --> 19:09.400
who are contributing to the fund,

19:09.760 --> 19:10.900
and we've got the finest lawyers.

19:11.180 --> 19:13.620
And I'm lining up a really juicy case in Canada

19:13.620 --> 19:15.600
against the Canadian government,

19:15.720 --> 19:16.320
a civil action.

19:16.780 --> 19:17.980
For what was done to you,

19:18.080 --> 19:19.300
the railroading and so on?

19:19.620 --> 19:21.200
The wrongful imprisonment,

19:21.340 --> 19:22.020
defamation,

19:22.360 --> 19:24.420
we're lining up the records on that now

19:24.420 --> 19:26.440
with the assistance of the American government.

19:26.440 --> 19:28.820
And as soon as the dossier is complete,

19:28.920 --> 19:30.460
I'm going to go all out for the Grand Slam

19:30.460 --> 19:31.600
against the swine who did it.

19:32.340 --> 19:34.380
Now, we have a few minutes left,

19:34.460 --> 19:36.220
and I wanted to ask you about an article

19:36.220 --> 19:38.160
which appeared in the Canadian Jewish News

19:38.160 --> 19:43.280
about Goebbels' New of Holocaust archival document reveals.

19:43.900 --> 19:45.840
Now, I faxed you that particular article.

19:46.540 --> 19:48.360
Yes, I read it with great interest an hour ago,

19:48.680 --> 19:51.300
and even before I finished reading the article,

19:51.500 --> 19:53.880
I dug deep into the heap of my Goebbels manuscript,

19:53.880 --> 19:56.700
which, believe me, stands one foot high on the desk

19:56.700 --> 19:58.220
as I'm speaking now.

19:58.840 --> 20:00.220
And halfway down there, sure enough,

20:00.400 --> 20:02.080
I knew what this speech was.

20:02.180 --> 20:04.520
It's a very flimsy document in the British archives,

20:04.620 --> 20:07.700
four pages of very flimsy English-sized paper

20:07.700 --> 20:09.580
typed on an English typewriter,

20:10.220 --> 20:13.540
recording in German an alleged text

20:13.540 --> 20:17.400
of a speech by Goebbels on September 26, 1942.

20:18.100 --> 20:22.040
Why do you stress English typewriter and English paper?

20:22.040 --> 20:24.940
Because the question of authenticity comes up, obviously.

20:25.500 --> 20:28.480
It's a speech in which Goebbels appears to reveal

20:28.480 --> 20:31.040
that he knows what's happening to Jews in the East,

20:31.180 --> 20:32.560
the Jews being shipped out of Berlin.

20:32.960 --> 20:33.740
He's not explicit.

20:34.400 --> 20:35.900
He doesn't go in, but he hints at it

20:35.900 --> 20:36.840
in a kind of ugly way.

20:36.900 --> 20:37.500
But you've got to remember,

20:37.620 --> 20:38.980
this isn't a verbatim transcript.

20:39.240 --> 20:41.240
It's written down by one of the 60 journalists

20:41.240 --> 20:42.520
who was present, if it's authentic.

20:43.260 --> 20:45.220
Why it should be on English paper, I don't know.

20:45.680 --> 20:47.300
It came through very murky channels

20:47.300 --> 20:49.180
back into the hands of the British Foreign Office

20:49.180 --> 20:51.680
a month later, not until about six months later.

20:52.940 --> 20:54.580
I've investigated in great detail,

20:54.880 --> 20:57.160
and I'm sorry to say that I investigated it

20:57.160 --> 20:58.480
because that's how it's now come out

20:58.480 --> 21:00.560
in the Canadian Jewish magazine.

21:01.620 --> 21:03.360
Part of the investigation I carried out,

21:03.440 --> 21:05.040
I was reluctant to use this document

21:05.040 --> 21:07.060
in my biography until I'd tested to authenticity.

21:07.940 --> 21:09.520
And I wrote to the Polish authorities

21:09.520 --> 21:11.380
to ask if they could identify a man

21:11.380 --> 21:14.800
who's named in the document

21:14.800 --> 21:16.040
as being the source of it,

21:16.300 --> 21:17.540
the person who brought it out.

21:18.040 --> 21:19.560
And they identified this man to me.

21:19.600 --> 21:21.440
But obviously, these Polish authorities

21:21.440 --> 21:23.520
immediately gave the documents which I had

21:23.520 --> 21:25.600
to the Canadian Jewish people

21:25.600 --> 21:26.800
who scooped me.

21:27.700 --> 21:29.720
Okay, well, that's the way the cookie crumbles.

21:30.200 --> 21:31.000
They, needless to say,

21:31.040 --> 21:32.100
haven't given me the credit for it

21:32.100 --> 21:33.580
any more than the world's newspapers

21:33.580 --> 21:34.900
gave credit to me for having found

21:34.900 --> 21:35.500
the Goebbelsdorff

21:35.500 --> 21:37.040
in the Moscow archives last summer.

21:38.240 --> 21:39.640
The authenticity question

21:39.640 --> 21:40.720
is still a bit bothersome.

21:40.720 --> 21:41.940
I'm inclined to believe

21:41.940 --> 21:43.540
that the document is genuine,

21:43.960 --> 21:46.200
but it's probably not an accurate rendition

21:46.200 --> 21:47.300
of what Goebbels said.

21:49.400 --> 21:51.100
The reason I think it's probably genuine

21:51.100 --> 21:52.320
is that there are one or two phrases

21:52.320 --> 21:53.000
in the document,

21:53.300 --> 21:54.840
and I've gone into this in my book

21:54.840 --> 21:55.480
in some detail.

21:56.260 --> 21:57.240
There are one or two phrases

21:57.240 --> 21:57.780
in the document

21:57.780 --> 21:59.020
which Goebbels actually uses

21:59.020 --> 22:01.380
in speeches around about that time.

22:02.100 --> 22:04.020
The same kind of recurring ideas turn up.

22:04.940 --> 22:07.940
So, it doesn't say anything

22:07.940 --> 22:08.880
really new to us

22:08.880 --> 22:11.180
because those of us who are wise,

22:11.300 --> 22:12.280
we've always said that

22:12.280 --> 22:15.080
something did happen to the Jews.

22:15.240 --> 22:16.900
Large numbers of Jews did suffer

22:16.900 --> 22:18.140
on the Eastern Front.

22:18.320 --> 22:19.980
There were occasional massacres

22:19.980 --> 22:21.320
on a kind of My Lai scale,

22:21.420 --> 22:22.340
and that a lot of the Jews

22:22.340 --> 22:23.380
who were thrown out of Berlin

22:23.380 --> 22:24.340
during the war years

22:24.340 --> 22:25.180
never came back.

22:25.700 --> 22:27.140
So, what do you make, though,

22:27.180 --> 22:28.900
of the statement by Saul Littman,

22:29.060 --> 22:30.960
who is quoted in the Canadian Jewish News?

22:30.960 --> 22:33.860
It puts a nail in the coffin

22:33.860 --> 22:35.460
of Holocaust deniers.

22:37.320 --> 22:38.840
Mr. Littman's still got to explain

22:38.840 --> 22:39.400
to you and me

22:39.400 --> 22:40.660
how it's possible to gas people

22:40.660 --> 22:41.860
without leaving any cyanide

22:41.860 --> 22:43.080
in the walls of the gas chambers.

22:43.780 --> 22:45.620
I mean, that's what it boils down to.

22:46.020 --> 22:48.300
None of us has really denied

22:48.300 --> 22:50.000
that a lot of Jews were massacred

22:50.000 --> 22:50.840
on the Eastern Front,

22:51.300 --> 22:52.600
including the Jews from Berlin.

22:52.860 --> 22:54.320
And the fact that Goebbels knew this

22:54.320 --> 22:55.860
or suspected this was going on

22:55.860 --> 22:57.420
doesn't really put a nail

22:57.420 --> 22:58.780
in your coffin or mine, Ernst.

23:00.380 --> 23:01.980
I am astounded.

23:02.360 --> 23:05.480
I'm astounded when I read in this article

23:05.480 --> 23:09.140
that there were 48,000 Jews

23:09.140 --> 23:10.300
still in Berlin

23:10.300 --> 23:13.040
on September the 23rd, 1942.

23:13.940 --> 23:15.500
Oh, I've got the exact figures

23:15.500 --> 23:16.460
in my Goebbels book

23:16.460 --> 23:17.040
all the way through.

23:17.240 --> 23:20.580
They started off with 74,000 or 75,000

23:20.580 --> 23:21.600
at the beginning of the war,

23:22.240 --> 23:24.220
and they gradually whittled the figures down

23:24.220 --> 23:27.000
by transports to the Eastern Front,

23:27.120 --> 23:28.540
to Riga and to Minsk and to Lodz.

23:28.560 --> 23:29.920
We know exactly when the trains left,

23:30.120 --> 23:31.300
and usually we know exactly

23:31.300 --> 23:33.120
how many Jews were on the trains concerned.

23:33.840 --> 23:36.180
And the real villain behind this,

23:36.540 --> 23:37.840
oddly enough, wasn't Hitler,

23:38.340 --> 23:39.260
and it wasn't Goebbels,

23:39.360 --> 23:40.860
but it was that well-known hero

23:40.860 --> 23:42.440
of the liberal establishment,

23:42.640 --> 23:43.200
Albert Speer.

23:43.600 --> 23:45.140
He was the one who was in charge

23:45.140 --> 23:46.520
of turfing all the Jews

23:46.520 --> 23:48.220
out of the houses in Berlin

23:48.220 --> 23:49.600
because Albert Speer

23:49.600 --> 23:51.040
wanted their apartments empty

23:51.040 --> 23:52.600
for his own slum clearance program.

23:52.600 --> 23:55.060
This is quite clear

23:55.060 --> 23:56.660
from Albert Speer's genuine diary,

23:57.040 --> 23:58.440
which we've got.

23:58.660 --> 24:01.640
So now, are you then saying

24:01.640 --> 24:04.880
that this is not the key document

24:04.880 --> 24:06.480
that Saul Littman makes it out?

24:07.960 --> 24:10.400
Let's look behind his statement, Ernst.

24:10.760 --> 24:12.080
Isn't the real significance

24:12.080 --> 24:12.660
of his statement

24:12.660 --> 24:13.980
that he still thinks it necessary

24:13.980 --> 24:15.120
50 years later to say,

24:15.200 --> 24:16.420
here, here's another key document

24:16.420 --> 24:17.680
proving the revisionist's wrong.

24:17.940 --> 24:19.240
They're still searching, aren't they?

24:19.240 --> 24:20.740
They're still searching

24:20.740 --> 24:22.160
for that smoking gun,

24:22.240 --> 24:22.920
for the one document

24:22.920 --> 24:24.200
that proves you and me

24:24.200 --> 24:25.120
and Fred Leuchter

24:25.120 --> 24:26.460
and Faurisson

24:26.460 --> 24:27.680
and all the rest of them wrong.

24:27.820 --> 24:29.020
And they still haven't found it.

24:29.080 --> 24:29.820
They're still searching

24:29.820 --> 24:31.320
and still coming up

24:31.320 --> 24:32.700
with slime all over their hands,

24:32.940 --> 24:34.240
waving yet another document

24:34.240 --> 24:34.700
in the air saying,

24:34.780 --> 24:35.980
here you are, conclusive proof.

24:36.880 --> 24:37.460
A year later,

24:37.500 --> 24:38.160
they'll do it again,

24:38.300 --> 24:39.100
which proves that, of course,

24:39.160 --> 24:40.160
this year's conclusive proof

24:40.160 --> 24:41.620
wasn't all that conclusive after all.

24:41.620 --> 24:43.260
Now, in closing,

24:43.580 --> 24:45.500
there is much made lately

24:45.500 --> 24:47.260
about a thing by Pressac,

24:47.680 --> 24:49.480
a French pharmacist.

24:50.180 --> 24:50.300
Yes.

24:50.520 --> 24:52.680
And how about...

24:52.680 --> 24:53.480
Cheers for Pressac.

24:54.040 --> 24:55.560
Do you think the Jewish community

24:55.560 --> 24:56.340
have realized yet

24:56.340 --> 24:57.500
that he's our Trojan horse?

24:59.000 --> 25:00.140
And you say that, why?

25:00.460 --> 25:01.240
Why do you say that?

25:01.660 --> 25:02.520
Why do you say that?

25:03.280 --> 25:04.620
Because every time

25:04.620 --> 25:05.820
Pressac publishes a book,

25:06.120 --> 25:07.320
he does more damage

25:07.320 --> 25:09.640
to the Holocaust cause

25:09.640 --> 25:11.960
than good.

25:12.920 --> 25:14.560
In his latest book, of course,

25:14.620 --> 25:15.820
the really crucial damage

25:15.820 --> 25:16.420
that he's done

25:16.420 --> 25:18.740
is publishing the figures

25:18.740 --> 25:20.420
of coke consumption

25:20.420 --> 25:22.380
of the Auschwitz crematoria

25:22.380 --> 25:23.220
during the war years.

25:23.380 --> 25:24.940
We want to hasten

25:24.940 --> 25:26.520
not coke that we snorted

25:26.520 --> 25:27.340
or sniffed,

25:27.560 --> 25:28.760
but coke that is burned

25:28.760 --> 25:29.540
in crematories.

25:30.540 --> 25:31.480
I suppose for the

25:31.480 --> 25:32.420
North American listeners

25:32.420 --> 25:33.500
it's necessary to make

25:33.500 --> 25:34.260
that point clear.

25:34.260 --> 25:37.560
The Auschwitz crematoria

25:37.560 --> 25:39.500
were provided

25:39.500 --> 25:42.680
with 2,188 metric tons

25:42.680 --> 25:44.040
of coke during the war years.

25:45.460 --> 25:46.940
That's a flat and final figure.

25:47.080 --> 25:47.520
It comes from the

25:47.520 --> 25:48.260
Soviet archives,

25:48.500 --> 25:49.340
the records of the

25:49.340 --> 25:50.200
Auschwitz concentration

25:50.200 --> 25:51.100
camp administration.

25:51.920 --> 25:53.900
2,188 tons of coke,

25:53.980 --> 25:54.720
and if you divide that

25:54.720 --> 25:56.240
by 35 or 40 kilograms

25:56.240 --> 25:57.240
of coke per body,

25:57.340 --> 25:57.900
which is cremated,

25:58.040 --> 25:59.660
which is very good going indeed,

25:59.760 --> 26:00.780
as any crematoria manager

26:00.780 --> 26:01.300
will tell you,

26:02.140 --> 26:03.100
you're going to end up

26:03.100 --> 26:05.080
with that famous 65,000 figure again.

26:05.260 --> 26:06.320
The one which you've always said

26:06.320 --> 26:07.180
is the number of people

26:07.180 --> 26:07.800
who were cremated

26:07.800 --> 26:08.920
in the Auschwitz crematoria.

26:09.440 --> 26:10.700
You get that figure also

26:10.700 --> 26:12.140
by looking at the handling rate

26:12.140 --> 26:12.920
of the crematoria.

26:13.240 --> 26:15.980
You can give broad areas

26:15.980 --> 26:17.980
of roughly how many people

26:17.980 --> 26:18.820
could have been burned

26:18.820 --> 26:19.700
in those crematoria

26:19.700 --> 26:20.880
during the period

26:20.880 --> 26:21.580
they were in operation.

26:22.220 --> 26:22.700
And of course,

26:22.760 --> 26:23.520
you get the same figure,

26:23.600 --> 26:24.420
65,000,

26:24.420 --> 26:25.200
in the death books

26:25.200 --> 26:26.240
of Auschwitz

26:26.240 --> 26:26.740
where the Russians

26:26.740 --> 26:27.160
have released

26:27.160 --> 26:28.520
a few years back.

26:28.940 --> 26:30.500
66,000 names there.

26:30.500 --> 26:32.240
And the British

26:32.240 --> 26:32.880
have just released

26:32.880 --> 26:33.360
a document,

26:33.520 --> 26:33.800
of course,

26:34.480 --> 26:35.700
a code-breaking intercept

26:35.700 --> 26:37.120
of police reports

26:37.120 --> 26:38.720
saying that in August 1942

26:38.720 --> 26:41.420
there were 8,000 deaths

26:41.420 --> 26:42.140
in Auschwitz

26:42.140 --> 26:43.140
from epidemics.

26:43.140 --> 26:44.880
Pressac,

26:45.020 --> 26:45.700
by publishing

26:45.700 --> 26:47.000
these invoices

26:47.000 --> 26:47.700
and figures

26:47.700 --> 26:48.420
and orders

26:48.420 --> 26:49.480
that he does

26:49.480 --> 26:50.600
so accreviously,

26:50.800 --> 26:50.900
you know,

26:50.940 --> 26:51.420
I mean,

26:51.500 --> 26:52.880
he is a great collector

26:52.880 --> 26:55.220
of facsimile reproductions

26:55.220 --> 26:56.760
in his first book

26:56.760 --> 26:57.720
and now in his second book.

26:57.740 --> 26:58.060
He's not very good

26:58.060 --> 26:58.920
at digesting them

26:58.920 --> 27:00.520
and free chairs for it

27:00.520 --> 27:01.220
because he's provided

27:01.220 --> 27:01.800
the morsels

27:01.800 --> 27:02.420
and we're doing

27:02.420 --> 27:03.020
the digesting.

27:03.600 --> 27:04.380
He didn't realize

27:04.380 --> 27:05.380
the damage he was doing

27:05.380 --> 27:05.920
by publishing

27:05.920 --> 27:07.240
the coke consumption figures.

27:07.740 --> 27:08.380
I see what he did.

27:08.460 --> 27:08.560
I mean,

27:08.560 --> 27:08.960
if he did,

27:09.020 --> 27:09.820
he wouldn't have published it

27:09.820 --> 27:10.460
or perhaps he would.

27:10.520 --> 27:10.920
I don't know.

27:10.920 --> 27:11.900
So once again,

27:12.040 --> 27:13.940
we have physical evidence

27:13.940 --> 27:16.260
rather than eyewitnesses

27:16.260 --> 27:16.940
or rumors

27:16.940 --> 27:18.600
or anything like that.

27:18.700 --> 27:18.840
I mean,

27:18.960 --> 27:20.660
every time our opponents

27:20.660 --> 27:21.600
try to prove us wrong,

27:21.720 --> 27:22.420
it's by trickery

27:22.420 --> 27:23.000
and distortion.

27:24.540 --> 27:25.300
Mr. Irving,

27:25.360 --> 27:26.320
I thank you very much

27:26.320 --> 27:27.080
for this,

27:27.220 --> 27:27.740
once again,

27:27.820 --> 27:28.720
very interesting

27:28.720 --> 27:30.500
and illuminating analysis.

27:31.640 --> 27:32.140
And I hope...

27:32.140 --> 27:32.600
It's very nice to talk to you.

27:32.640 --> 27:32.820
Yeah,

27:32.860 --> 27:33.860
and I hope that we can

27:33.860 --> 27:35.760
help you with the fighting fund

27:35.760 --> 27:37.860
and we will repeat

27:37.860 --> 27:39.880
the address

27:39.880 --> 27:40.800
one more time

27:40.800 --> 27:41.620
if you wouldn't mind.

27:42.480 --> 27:42.760
Okay.

27:43.120 --> 27:44.520
People can contact me

27:44.520 --> 27:45.840
direct in London

27:45.840 --> 27:47.400
at 81 Duke Street,

27:48.000 --> 27:48.200
Duke,

27:48.320 --> 27:49.040
that's D-U-K,

27:49.440 --> 27:50.080
Duke Street,

27:50.160 --> 27:50.380
London,

27:50.500 --> 27:51.100
W-1.

27:51.880 --> 27:52.440
Or if they're

27:52.440 --> 27:53.100
in the United States,

27:53.180 --> 27:53.820
they can write to me

27:53.820 --> 27:55.220
direct at a post office box

27:55.220 --> 27:55.780
that we maintain

27:55.780 --> 27:56.560
in the United States

27:56.560 --> 27:59.060
which is P.O. Box 1707

27:59.060 --> 28:00.580
in Key West,

28:00.800 --> 28:01.140
Florida,

28:01.800 --> 28:03.180
33040.

28:04.580 --> 28:05.240
Very good.

28:05.480 --> 28:06.320
I'll always answer.

28:06.580 --> 28:06.800
Yeah,

28:06.900 --> 28:07.840
I thank you very much

28:07.840 --> 28:08.360
for this.

28:09.060 --> 28:09.640
Thank you very much,

28:09.640 --> 28:09.740
again.

28:09.760 --> 28:10.000
Righto,

28:10.080 --> 28:10.340
goodnight.

28:10.420 --> 28:10.660
Goodnight.

28:10.660 --> 28:12.660
You